EP123: True Talent - How to Act as Valued Partners

All-In Recruitment is a podcast by Manatal focusing on all things related to the recruitment industry’s missions and trends. Join us in our weekly conversations with leaders in the recruitment space and learn their best practices to transform the way you hire.

This transcript has been edited for clarity.

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Lydia: Welcome to the All In Recruitment podcast by Manatal, where we explore best practices, learnings, and trends with leaders in the recruitment space. If you like our content, please subscribe to our YouTube and Spotify channels to stay tuned for our weekly episodes.

I'm your host, Lydia, and with us this week is Brittany Zamani, founder and CEO of True Talent. Great to have you with us, Brittany.

Brittany: Thank you so much. I'm very excited to be here.

Exploring Content, Marketing, and Automation

Lydia: So walk us through your experience in talent acquisition, Brittany and what's the mission behind True Talent.

Brittany: Yes, thank you so much. So I've been in mostly technical talent acquisition for 15 years. In my first five years, I started in a technical recruiting agency where I really got a lot of wonderful education and training. I built my foundation there, and I spent the last 10 years working for recruiting for startups and Fortune 500 companies, Meta, PayPal, and Apple.

This has sort of been a dream of mine to kind of create and build out my own recruitment agency, just sort of taking bits and pieces of everything I've learned all along the way and kind of incorporating it into an offering that is very customizable for my clients, and also allows them to kind of tap into my network. So True Talent was born just recently, and I'm very excited.

Lydia: What are some areas that you're looking at for True Talent at this stage?

Brittany: Yes, I'm having a lot of fun just really kind of learning and playing around with different tools. There are so many different AI tools and capabilities. There's a lot of noise around video right now, and a lot of really cool video editing tools. Canva has been my best friend. So I'm just having a lot of fun, kind of diving in and figuring out what will be my tool stack, and what will work for certain areas, whether it's content, digital marketing, or AI sourcing for candidate reach-outs.

I'm kind of creating different automated drip campaigns for client reach-outs and business development. So right now, True Talents is sort of at the infancy stage where we're really kind of figuring out what is going to work best for us in terms of technology.

Lydia: So going back to the bread and butter of sourcing [candidates], how do you find your candidates? What sort of sourcing channels work best for you?

Brittany: Yes, I use quite a few. I've used many different tools in the past, and I think LinkedIn always ends up being your main, most successful tool as far as sourcing goes. What's great about LinkedIn is it's so robust. There are so many different ways to source.

Years ago, a lot of us were really sourcing in similar ways on LinkedIn—writing Boolean strings and sourcing based on industries or competitors—which is certainly something I still do. Now, I really like to get scrappy and in the weeds, and I think there's a lot of really good information as far as candidate details. Learning about different types of talent through posts or the news feed on LinkedIn is something I actually do. I scrape through comments. I look at who's liking what, who's been laid off, and who's looking for a job.

I have friends who have worked with other people who have been laid off, and that gives you some insight into those candidates and who's worked with whom. There's a lot of interesting research and insight you can grab from just some of that activity that's right there live on your news feed. I love to scrape through that as a creative channel on LinkedIn.

Empower Recruiters to Build Trust and Add Value

Lydia: Interesting. In terms of recruiters, what are some common mistakes? I mean, in your experience, really, what are some common mistakes that recruiters tend to make, and how can they go about avoiding them, maybe even in terms of sourcing or reaching out to passive candidates?

Brittany: Yes, this is a great question. I love talking about this. I spent the last three years leading very senior technical recruitment teams at both PayPal and Meta. One of my big things in terms of leadership—sort of a pet peeve of mine—is that I really don't understand or condone order-takers. A lot of recruiters fall into that role of being an order taker, and while that may feel more comfortable or natural for some folks, I really like to empower my recruiters to establish trusting relationships through bold actions.

Some of that involves pushing back, saying no, explaining and educating about processes, and truly adding value as a recruitment partner. When you start to add that value and stand confidently as a subject matter expert, you'll also be met with the same type of respect from your client.

They’ll see you as a real expert in the industry, a valued partner, and they’ll respect and want to work with you more.

I empower my recruiters to conduct deep intakes and have thoughtful discussions throughout the process—not just with hiring managers, but with candidates as well. This involves constantly checking in, having detailed conversations on both ends, and being a strong thought partner and educator throughout the process, rather than just managing it tactically.

This industry has a lot of order-takers, and I think that’s a common mistake. Many recruiters just show up, gather what they need, and treat it as a transactional process. That’s part of the reason I created True Talent—to offer a more customized, white-glove, thoughtful approach for my clients as a valued partner.

Lydia: So, Brittany, in your experience, or rather your observation, what is the difference between someone who treats the job as mere order taking or just doing their basics, versus someone who really puts that value into the conversations that they have with different stakeholders? What is the difference? Is it a personality trait? Is it drive, or is it commitment to the job?

Brittany: I think that passion has to be there. Curiosity has to come from within. For me, I'm a naturally curious person. I ask a lot of questions and like to be inquisitive. I think those traits that some recruiters may have naturally can often make them some of the best recruiters and recruitment leaders.

What’s really important is understanding the driver behind a role. Why is this role open? How does it impact the business? Are we creating a product? Are we designing something? Are we launching something in a few months that we need to know about? I always want my recruiters to get that buy-in and understand the true impact and value this role has on the company, the team, or whatever it may be.

When they have that passion and buy-in, they can sell that back to the candidate, which creates a much better experience for everyone. I don’t think this exists with every recruiter and every process. There are recruiters who just take the job description or minimum requirements and work from that. But I like to understand the full picture of how this position impacts the rest of the company, and I think that’s really important.

Leverage Past Relationships to Find New Clients

Lydia: Now moving on to clients. You've just set up True Talent. So, this would be an exciting time to go about finding your new clients. You're talking about your campaigns, and reaching out to new clients. So what's been your most effective channel when it comes to finding new clients?

Brittany: I think for me, having been in this industry for 15 years, I've supported so many different types of leaders—on the business side, the recruitment side, and in engineering. I wouldn’t say they’re necessarily new clients, but right now, I’m having fun reaching out to a lot of clients I used to support five, seven, or even ten years ago.

These include old hiring managers of mine or friends I’ve recruited with who are now in engineering or product. Many of them are hiring, and a lot of people I’ve known in the past are now starting businesses—they’re founders or small business owners.

When you start your own agency, the hardest thing is going after cold clients—clients you’ve never worked with and who don’t know you. So I’m really focused on fostering the relationships I’ve built over the last 15 years, checking in with them, seeing what’s new with them, explaining what’s new with me, and teaching them about True Talent.

That’s where I’m spending a lot of my time right now. Through that, I network and meet new people, making it easier to connect with new clients who are a bit warmer compared to someone who has no idea who I am on LinkedIn.

Lydia: So your first major client for True Talent, for instance, was that an existing relationship? Or how did you land that deal?

Brittany: I have to thank a few friends who are small business owners. One owns a traffic engineering business here in Austin, and another owns a digital marketing firm, also in Austin. Both of them, along with others over the last three to five years, have come to me saying, “Hey, I’m having the hardest time hiring. I can’t find talent for my team. I don’t have time to recruit. I don’t know what I’m doing. Can you help me? Can you hire for me? We need your help.”

I’m a mom of three and have always worked in corporate recruiting, so of course, I said no. I didn’t have time to help them. But after saying no for so many years, I realized there’s really a need for startups and small businesses to have support when they can’t stand up their own recruiting teams internally.

My first few clients were small business owners—friends who needed help hiring, didn’t know how to hire, and didn’t even know some of the profiles they were hiring for. They knew my background in engineering and from supporting different tech companies. So, fostering those relationships and finally saying “yes” is how I got my first couple of clients.

Lydia: In terms of communicating ROI, is that a big deal when it comes to an existing relationship? Is there a very formal conversation when you talk about this ROI? How does that go about with your potential clients, or even the clients that you know?

Brittany: Yes, definitely. I think this can be a bit of a saturated market, especially now, with so many people going out on their own. It's really important to explain how you're different, why you'll be different, and what the ROI really looks like.

For me, the ROI I explain is tied to my background. When you're working with True Talent, you'll have access to our deep and wide network. We have a massive network across tech companies, products, engineering, and various types of engineering roles. Another reason I started True Talent is because I have relationships with, in my opinion, some of the smartest, strongest talent out there—people I’ve hired in the past who are now senior-level leaders hiring for their own teams, or individuals in niche areas.

When I was at Apple, I recruited for very specific roles, from procurement and raw materials backgrounds to general software engineers specializing in Java, and even executive-level positions. I think that access to spectacular, smart talent in product, engineering, and supply chain is a huge return on your investment.

I can also customize solutions to fit what your team or business needs. Whether it’s packaging multiple roles we hire for, outsourcing your entire recruiting operations to me, or just filling a few specific roles—whether executive search or direct placement—I can make it mutually beneficial. It’s a very personal process, and you’ll have your hand held throughout the entire journey.

Lydia: So, in these conversations, I mean that whole relationship, or that process of getting the whole placements done and just having that as a successful deal, what's been the most surprising feedback you've received from a client?

This will be anything in terms of the quality of the client, or your service, etc, at this stage in True Talent.

Brittany: I think I’ve done this for so long, and yet I’m still surprised by how many businesses or very senior leaders in tech, product, and other fields are not familiar with the recruitment process or the different types of recruitment processes.

I have one example: I had a client who was really hesitant to work with me because they were such a small company—about 28 employees. Their culture was incredibly important to them, and that’s often the case with many of my clients. One bad hire can make a big impact in a 28- or 30-person company. They were almost unwilling to outsource the process of interviewing or screening candidates for culture because it was so critical to them.

When I sat them down and explained the process I take on, how I can transfer some of that knowledge from them, and how I can essentially stand in for them to screen candidates in depth for things like culture, they were really surprised. They didn’t realize that was part of the process or that it was something I could take on. That surprised me too, but it’s also part of why I love what I do.

I enjoy educating people on how the process can work. We can do things differently; we can do things traditionally. We can use holistic hiring models, bar-raising hiring models, or whatever approach fits best to solve a specific challenge in hiring.

It’s been really fun to educate new clients on these possibilities. That said, I’m still surprised to encounter so many senior leaders in 2020 and beyond who are still learning about how to attract, hire, and retain talent.

Lydia: Quite frankly, there's a lot of education involved in talking, but that also enriches the relationship, I would imagine, right?

Brittany: Absolutely, yes. It's been really fun for me.

Learn From Experienced Professionals and Stay Humble

Lydia: So finally, what advice would you give someone who is starting out in this space today, or maybe even starting out a new business in the recruitment space, Brittany?

Brittany: Starting out in recruiting can be so overwhelming. You really have to be patient with yourself and give yourself a lot of grace to learn over the course of years. It takes time to get to a place where you understand all the nuanced parts of the process, no matter what you’re recruiting for or what the skill sets are.

If you’re just starting out in talent acquisition or recruiting, I’d say be patient with yourself. Make friends with people who have been in the field for a long time, and learn as much as you can from them. Be humble about it.

Starting an agency feels like being an old dog learning a new trick. I’ve done things a certain way for so long, and now I’m doing it my way, but it’s all brand new. I have to take my own advice: give myself grace, be patient, and understand that it’s going to take some time.

One tip I have for anyone looking to start their own firm is to listen to recruiting podcasts like this one. Learning from other founders, recruiters, and leaders in the industry has been incredibly helpful for me. I listen to at least two podcasts a day, every day, and it’s been enormously beneficial in my education—not just around starting a recruiting agency, but starting a business in general.

I’d recommend podcasts all day long.

Lydia: Well, thank you so much, Brittany. I'm sure there'll be someone who's going to gain great insight from what you've shared, especially transitioning from being in-house, or having all those experiences and transferring that onto your own setup.

I'm sure there'll be someone who will definitely be able to glean that kind of insight from you. So thanks a lot for your time and these insights. For those listening in who might want to pick up a conversation with you or connect with you, where's the best place they can do so?

Brittany: I'm everywhere. You can find me on LinkedIn, Brittany Zamani on LinkedIn. You can find True Talent, of course, on LinkedIn, you can visit our website. Our website is currently under construction. It should be back up in about two weeks. It's truetalentx.com and all the information is right there.

So let's connect. I'd love to chat with anyone who is maybe looking for a job or looking for some help scaling their team.

Lydia: Thank you again, Brittany. It's such a pleasure to have you. We have been in conversation with Brittany Zamani, founder and CEO of True Talent. Thank you for joining us and remember to subscribe to stay tuned for more weekly episodes from All In Recruitment.